Best AA Build

[Darkmatter]

Turrets can almost be made endlessly (speaking in terms of micro-ing time costs) around ur base at almost neglible costs, while on the other hand you gotta make a drone, wait, build creep colony, wait, evolve into spore colony, wait, and finally do you get ur spore colony.

Whilst you need to make an Engineering Bay, which costs 125. Also, you need 75 to make an Evolution Chamber for Zerg to get their Spore Colonies, which takes less minerals to make then the Engineering Bay and it builds faster. You can get spores close to the time you can get Turrets, if not faster. So you have to make an SCV, Wait, Build an Engineering Bay, then build Turrets. Zerg can have Creep Colonies waiting to be morphed right as their evolution chamber completes.

on the other hand, turrets just take an scv and placing ur turret where you want it and then you can leave it alone (basically a "set it and forget it" kind of thing) INSTEAD of microing around with drones and larvae, critical "game screen" time that could probably be better spent doing something else (cause ur almost always making spore colonies mid-game to protect against corsairs primarily and mid-game is the weakest time for a zerg player

Erm...if you have decent micro, pushing B, C on the area you want to build then doing something else and going back when it spawns to push S shouldn't be that hard. Then again for you it might be. Ir's easy enough for me. Hotkeys rock.

now although spore colonies are twice as tough as a turret, turrets make up this deficiency with their numbers. Usually 2-3 turrets in a terran base are equilivant to 1 spore colony or 1 cannon in a zerg or protoss base. its much more common to see a line of turrets around a terran base than spores circling a zerg base.

Your numbers mean jack when I can make Colonies faster then you can make Turrets. Unless you want to rival me by wasting minerals on 12 SCV's which take food as well to build 12 turrets at a time. I can make 12 Drones in one swoop, and morph them into creep colonies. Then into Spore Colonies. While it does take more time, they are better stat wise individually so it more then makes up for it. Sure, not many Zerg Players online like Air Defense. If you know how to spread your creep right it isn't a problem though. ^^

that aside, i hardly think HP of w/e AA defense you got (spore, turret, cannon) will hardly matter against the primarily attackers of them: BC, Guardians, and Carriers. Those AA defense are gunna get hit hard when those massed air units attack and then their purpose switches from deterrent to air attacks to acting simply as food for those attacking air units until your army arrives to defend. any player always focuses their attention on AA def and that focused, massed firepower makes quick work of any HP on AA def.

It wont matter eh? 200 More HP. Faster attack speed. It'll hold the enemy off a little bit longer and do more damage. Please explain to me how this hardly matters. If you can, I'll quit debating this issue with you all-together. Last I checked, 200 HP units died faster then 400 HP units. Focus Fire does make quick work of AA Defense. But your Turrets will die before my Spore Colonies will, I guarantee that.

also, kinda on a side-note, following an air attack on ur stationary AA defenses, terran can much easily regenerate their AA defenses by pulling a couple SCVs off their min line to make turrets. zerg players must permanently pull drones off their min line to replace the spore colonies or make more drones, critical larvae that should be used to replenish your depleted army force (after it gets pushed around from defending the air attack, although you'll probably make units first, then the drones, but you still gotta worry about ur wide open base subject to a follow up drop).

..Funny, because I always see a Zerg Player building more then 3 drones out of larva to make creep colonies or something else instead of ''pulling them, off the mineral track''. Remember, Zerg have hatcheries. Meaning I can build my harvester faster then you can build yours. Even if you make a few more Command Centers, I'll still out produce you in workers to morph my colonies. It may not be as fast as 2 SCV's on Turret Duty, but it's a quick fix. If you're like me and make lots of hatcheries, you can possibly match a Terran Player in speed as far as building the AA Structures is concerned.

so... after all this explanation, it call comes down to making 2-3 turrets for every one spore colony then you'll find they are pretty equilivent in firepower, HP, and capabilities. you gotta go back to ur scv turret maker twice to equal one spore colony but the time spent i believe is a fraction than that spent on a spore.

It does depend on how many you're willing to make. I like to make plenty, meaning I wont die as fast as you do. You could make more turrets but they die much faster to Focus Fire then spore colonies do. Again, Zerg can make 12 or more drones within 30 or so seconds, so numbers for Spore Colonies don't really matter when you can pump 12 at a time. Or hell, even 6 at a time. You get what you pay for.

and that i think is enuff!!

I would say so.

 

[CerebralChain]

Crimson.. You don't use Spore Colonies the same way you use Turrets.. I think that's one BIG point that you're missing there.

The most common usage for Spore Colonies is in the beginning, to protect against Corsairs or Wraiths, mainly. Spore Colonies aren't that important to Zerg as Turrets are to Terran.

 

[Phoenix2003]

Spore colonys cost 125, not 50.

175 if you include the loss of the drone.
So extractors actually costs 100 minerals.

 

[Vadriel]

My preference is Spores. They are just damned effective, although in the end they are the most costly, by losing a Drone. However, the others have good points too. The Turrets are fast, cheap, and repairable. The Cannons take a little longer to make, and are semi-expensive, BUT a big plus is the rate at which you can bring them about. Once a probe starts one warping, it can start another and another and another. I once massed Cannons at my gate and repelled an entire army of Zealots and Dragoons, 18 units in all, losing only 2 of my 8 Cannons. Besides the two destroyed ones, one other had damage on it, down to yellow. I realize that Zeals and Goons aren't air, but have you ever seen several Cannons batter the Hell out of Wraiths or Mutas? Holy crap the air doesn't stand a chance.

Even so, I much prefer Spores out of the three. On top of the high firing speed, I think they have longer range, too. They seem to shoot at you if you're on screen with them...it drives me crazy. Let me just put it this way: which do you hate to see when you are using nothing but air? For me it's Spores.

 

[Darkmatter]

I really hate Photon Cannons! To my knowledge, Photon Cannons have a firing range of 7, while spores and turrets have 6. (Not sure on this, I skimmed Blizzards site and some of the values are different then what I have in my pocketbook strategy guide. ><) For instance, they say Cannons cost 200 Minerals. Last I checked they costed 150, so ya....I'm confused. I just know Cannons are generally harder to kill with Guardians then the other species AA Buildinga since they have a greater firing range. (To my knowledge.) ^_^

 

[Crimson-Shade]

Crimson.. You don't use Spore Colonies the same way you use Turrets.. I think that's one BIG point that you're missing there.

The most common usage for Spore Colonies is in the beginning, to protect against Corsairs or Wraiths, mainly. Spore Colonies aren't that important to Zerg as Turrets are to Terran.

yeah, i can't mention every detail.... anywayz

i was mainly speaking of the positives vs negatives between spore colonies and turrets, not about the tactical/actual usage of spore colonies.

i understand that terran's have limited AA cover since rines aren't much good and gols are always part of your army usually away from ur base and that zerg players place less emphasis on spore colonies once they got hydralisks. But strictly doing a comparison in AA defense capabilities between a zerg base and terran base was what i was attempting to do.

and now for the refutals:

You can get spores close to the time you can get Turrets, if not faster. So you have to make an SCV, Wait, Build an Engineering Bay, then build Turrets. Zerg can have Creep Colonies waiting to be morphed right as their evolution chamber completes.

Right on some levels, but the point i made was that constructing a turret does not permanently deprive you of a worker. an SCV making a turret can STILL keep making turrets, unlike a zerg who must either make more drones (depriving larvae for something else) or lose marginal amounts of minerals.

And although the actual build times between evo chamber/engineering bay and spore colony/turret slightly favor zerg, this tiny change is almost neglible compared to the other points i made concerning this "time" issue.

Erm...if you have decent micro, pushing B, C on the area you want to build then doing something else and going back when it spawns to push S shouldn't be that hard. Then again for you it might be. Ir's easy enough for me. Hotkeys rock.

I'm not newb (520+ wins, 200 some losses), so i kknow all the hotkeys as well... but you must go back to your base a total of three times (make drone/pull drone, place creep colony, make creepy colony) while terran takes only two times (pull drone, make turret).

yeah, i know it may seem like nothing, but during hectic, by-the-teeth games against competitive opponents while playing as zerg (lots of units = lots of clicking), i find that every second counts. but ur right, this point probably has little consenquence except for economists.

Your numbers mean jack when I can make Colonies faster then you can make Turrets. Unless you want to rival me by wasting minerals on 12 SCV's which take food as well to build 12 turrets at a time. I can make 12 Drones in one swoop, and morph them into creep colonies. Then into Spore Colonies. While it does take more time, they are better stat wise individually so it more then makes up for it. Sure, not many Zerg Players online like Air Defense. If you know how to spread your creep right it isn't a problem though. ^^

You have 900 minerals laying around to make creep colonies? Besides, that, 600 minerals laying around to morph all those into spore colonies in one swoop? Most likely, the point I think you were trying to make is that zerg can erect AA def. faster than a terran could with the same resources.

You do not HAVE to make 12 additional SCV's to make 12 turrets in one swoop. It'd be easier to snatch just a few scv's and just have them making turrets continually. But i understand

It wont matter eh? 200 More HP. Faster attack speed. It'll hold the enemy off a little bit longer and do more damage. Please explain to me how this hardly matters. If you can, I'll quit debating this issue with you all-together. Last I checked, 200 HP units died faster then 400 HP units. Focus Fire does make quick work of AA Defense. But your Turrets will die before my Spore Colonies will, I guarantee that.

I never said turrets lasted longer than spore colonies.... i meant that if turrets can die in a single volley from 12 guardians, spore colonies will just need two volleys. ive never seen a game where spore colony's HP mattered enuff to make a difference againts high-end air units when focused fired upon.

..Funny, because I always see a Zerg Player building more then 3 drones out of larva to make creep colonies or something else instead of ''pulling them, off the mineral track''. Remember, Zerg have hatcheries. Meaning I can build my harvester faster then you can build yours. Even if you make a few more Command Centers, I'll still out produce you in workers to morph my colonies. It may not be as fast as 2 SCV's on Turret Duty, but it's a quick fix. If you're like me and make lots of hatcheries, you can possibly match a Terran Player in speed as far as building the AA Structures is concerned.

Harvester? erm....

anywayz, you just made my point in a different way. ur right that zerg can make workers to morph to creep colonies faster than terran. i was making a point that zerg player must use up larvae in the short-run to make those creep colonies thus an opportunity cost of forgoeing building attack units until a little bit later.

a final note when i gt back...

 

[Darkmatter]

No need to reply to all that. I spoke my point, and it's worked for me so I'm fine with it. All I can tell you is Zerg can compensate for making a worker for each building by having the workers come out faster. I.E Hatcheries. ^_^

 

[Firebat]

Turrets are better, cus i can repair them faster with a SCV than the spore colony heals itself, baaah

 

[Darkmatter]

Again, in a heated battle, that doesn't matter much.

 

[Crimson-Shade]

No need to reply to all that. I spoke my point, and it's worked for me so I'm fine with it. All I can tell you is Zerg can compensate for making a worker for each building by having the workers come out faster. I.E Hatcheries. ^_^

thanks...

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